Internet Gaming Bash of the Year 2014

[kernzy]

it's funny, that the most negative comments i receive, are from people with absolutely NO scores whatsoever.
nobodies.
useless eaters.
how dare you.

[F_Symbols]

Originally Posted by xelnia

As are many people today...

I don't see any mentioning of names here. Seems to be a rather bitter response (above^ and above again^^) for an entirely speculative assumption regarding an insult. Perhaps you missed the fact that someone has been dq'd for cheating already (see above in this very thread and everything!).

Ones status in a fictitious hierarchy in no way affects the relevance or credibility of their comments; who cares how good at what game he is.... He is ranked higher on a "competitive, multi-platform title" than ~600,000 other players, when combining all leaderboards and platforms. I would love to hear your comparable claim to "gaming fame" and an explanation of how it could possibly influence the credibility of your comments regarding generalizations about cheating in a tournament or possibly the modern gaming scene as a whole, who knows!

[kernzy]

If i were to upload all my scores to RU, you would realise.
now i am fighting against not only moderators, but total nobodies as well.
I obviously have failed somewhat.
idiot central.

[TodayIsForgotten]

Originally Posted by kernzy

If i were to upload all my scores to RU, you would realise.
now i am fighting against not only moderators, but total nobodies as well.
I obviously have failed somewhat.
holy fkn sheet.
idiot central.

I don't think the issue is your scores, it's the scores of dave and patrick. No need to get personal or attack others that only makes you look worse.

I would suggest if you really care as much as you are leading on, find a way to video tape your family playing. Sure it may not exonerate every party member but it will remove the suspicion and only leave you with a blemish for incorrect score keeping (e.g. odd number score in burnin rubber).

[Dudebro]

Originally Posted by kernzy

it's funny, that the most negative comments i receive, are from people with absolutely NO scores whatsoever.
nobodies.
useless eaters.
how fkn dare you.

Scores don't make someone credible.

Also you're not fighting against mods. The mods on RU are just doing their job by keeping things fair. If you don't like that then what's that say about your credibility?

I was gonna stay out of this but the last few posts bugged me. If you have a problem with another user report their post. This whole discussion about cheating seems to be getting out of hand anyways it should probably be ended and brought back to PMs.

[Thundarr]

maybe you guys can find it acceptable to just DQ the scores which have not been backed up with videos. I admit it looks bad considering the case you have made, but it can also be seen that it does not prove kernzy guilty. It is still possible he just got his bros to sign up because they can play even though they really aren't serious about it at all, just casual gamers.

If I had convinced my brother to play in a tournament to help my team, knowing him I'm sure he would not be going out of his way to pay attention to anyone or prove himself, he could care less because he is not really much into gaming anyway. but he is good at some games from back in the day & sometimes we play video games together. so I can see how this could happen without cheating. I could easily convince him to play for my team when he happens to be over gaming. but when asked to put out any more effort than that at any other time, he would just decline & not care, he's into other stuff.

True, this means they shouldn't really have been on the team if that's the case. But if this is the case it was a mistake but not cheating to get his bros into it.

so although you do have a strong suggestion without proof I would like to request that you all can agree to DQ Dave1 & patrick and any of kernzy's scores which he has not provided evidence for -- but let kernzy stay in the tournament with your strictness which gastrainga suggested.

I'm S.BAZ at HighScore.com as you will see, I sign "BAZ" for my Retrouprising scores. and they will match my IGBY scores for those games as well.

I understand i am to be considered biased for my team but we have been invited to give our input & kernzy says he hasn't cheated so without proof this is my vote!

---------- Post added at 09:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:23 PM ----------

Edit Avatar is in the list on the left hand side.[/QUOTE]

thank you Josephjo! that was tough to find

---------- Post added at 09:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:05 PM ----------

i just read through pages 14-16, hadn't seen the rest of this conversation... yeah kernzy is not right to call people useless & nobodies for not having a bunch of badass scores. I don't agree with that, but he is being accused of cheating here, he's probably just annoyed & needs to cool off a bit.

still voting same: DQ scores w/o videos ... fire dave & patrick if they don't show up .. let kernzy play!

[Slime Slayer]

Are we allowed to swear now?

[CrispyChicken]

I think I took care of the cursing. NO more cursing, especially at other players. We do not tolerate cursing at others. Keep it civilized or infractions/bans will be handed out. We can all say what we want to say without ripping at each others throats. Calm down.

---------- Post added at 12:41 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:39 AM ----------

Originally Posted by stevencassidy13

Are we allowed to swear now?

There was a slight change in the rules where as long as you aren't cursing at anyone directly and not cursing to flame then it's ok. And no trolling

[Jason L. Davis]

Originally Posted by ChrisP

I think I took care of the cursing. NO more cursing, especially at other players. We do not tolerate cursing at others. Keep it civilized or infractions/bans will be handed out. We can all say what we want to say without ripping at each others throats. Calm down.

---------- Post added at 12:41 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:39 AM ----------



There was a slight change in the rules where as long as you aren't cursing at anyone directly and not cursing to flame then it's ok. And no trolling

@#$%!..Lol

[CrispyChicken]

Originally Posted by Jason L. Davis

@#$%!..Lol

Honestly don't care if you guys just use symbols. Just don't make it obvious

[gastrainga]

Originally Posted by Thundarr

So although you do have a strong suggestion without proof I would like to request that you all can agree to DQ Dave1 & patrick and any of kernzy's scores which he has not provided evidence for -- but let kernzy stay in the tournament with your strictness which gastrainga suggested.

still voting same: DQ scores w/o videos ... fire dave & patrick if they don't show up .. let kernzy play!

Note that removing any of kernzy's scores that don't have videos would mean:

- 12 games would have to have his scores removed completely (Anteater, Bank Panic, Bomb Jack, Donkey Kong, Magic Sword, Moon Patrol, New Rally X, Pinball Action, Pooyan, Road Fighter, Splatterhouse, Super Spacefortress Macross)
- 2 games would have to be adjusted down (Frogger from 39,380 down to 35,430 and Kung Fu Master from 705,520 down to 641,110)
- Only on 5 games were replays provided of the top scores he submitted (19xx, Bubbles, Burning Rubber, Raiden, Sonic Wings).

So there would be changes on 14 of 19 games or 74% of the games. Pretty bad compliance with the rule requiring video evidence be kept for all scores.

-George

[Josephjo]

Originally Posted by kernzy

Every single avenue you ask for is a cul-de-sac.

Not so Paul. How difficult would it be for your brother Dave1 to join here?

Please answer the question at least if it's not possible and tell us why he can't.

Preferably without changing the subject or posting a link to one of your games on youtube.

Thanks

[gastrainga]

Originally Posted by kernzy

somehow, i don't think the date is the problem here.
desynchronisation is the problem.
after uploading "hundreds" of INP's to MARP, I see this as classic desynch.
Game plays perfectly up to a point, then it goes pear shaped.
It even says "gameplay stopped" long before gameplay stops for me. I think debating this is pointless.
there is obviously a problem, which is unrelated to my gameplay.

For the 3rd time, this isn't desync Paul. There is no debate; you just don't understand what desync of an INP file means. In order for the input to desynch with the gameplay, the input has to exist. In your replay the input STOPS, so there is no input to desync. If you record an input that is 30 minutes long and play it back, it will always playback the input for 30 minutes even if the input desyncs from the gameplay after 5 minutes and results in game over at that point and just random input after that during the attract screen (which you can see if you use the -iv 1 option on playback). As I've said several times already, just look at the size of this replay file compared to that of your 640K replay which does playback. This one is much, much smaller which means that it cannot possibly ever have been the replay for a 700K+ game.

Regardless, the issue is that this replay doesn't play back to the advertised score, which means it isn't evidence of the claimed score. As I've said before, I know you are capable of the claimed score, but that isn't the point. Per tournament rules you need to provide a replay you made during the tournament that plays back to the advertised score.

-George

[kernzy]

Thanks a lot Georgey. Your explanation makes total sense.
Obviously I have made a mistake somewhere. This will compound my fate.

It is 8:18 am.
I just arose abruptly with this thought/counter claim:

I am now calling out my deniers. My blamers, my accusers.
I am calling out Josephjo, Xelnia, Dr_SaGe, QAOP Spaceman, CaptainJivePants, todayis forgotten.
This is not a personal issue, do not think of it as so. please do not.
this is an experiment to see who can prove their online existence. I need you guys to provide me with a facebook account of yourself with your real name and a photograph. This has been asked of me, so i am now asking it of you.
If you cannot provide me with this, then you have no reason to accuse me of the same thing.
also, it was said: "No need to get personal or attack others that only makes you look worse."
Wait until you are accused of wrongdoing. anything i say to counterclaim this nonsense will be deemed as irrational "attacks", rather than honest "sticking up for myself". To be labelled is one thing, to be relabelled for my reactions is BANG OUT OF ORDER!!!

"I would suggest if you really care as much as you are leading on, find a way to video tape your family playing".
show me a video of you or your family playing. some people respect their privacy, and do not "show themselves" publicly. I know I don't.
This has obviously taken a turn for the worst. Any defence i make is now somehow a personal "attack". You are forgetting it is me who has been personally attacked. god damn your double standards.
people are free to make personal judgements/attacks on me, but for me to counter them, you accuse me of further wrongdoing. Stuff that.
That is blatant cyber bullying.
To go against an entire forum on my own is a despicable event. But i guarantee you this, I will never lie down and let a bunch of people i don't know try to roll me over.
Now people are stating that "swearing" is "out of line". I can see no better situation, where I am personally attacked, where swearing is a bad thing.
RU does not allow swearing, but it allows people to ridicule RAPE VICTIMS, that seems to be allowed. Obviously, RU has it's priorities back to front.
If any of RU mods have a family member who has been raped, you would banish this user. Unfortunately, you would rather banish someone with a bit of passion, instead.

my personal messages have been made public. I would never have done this to anyone. This is a betrayal of trust.
also, my honest messages on another website have been used against me on this website. adding to your ammunition.
How dare you take my honesty out of context, to further your agenda.
I have been given a raw deal, here. to blame me for countering this claim is BANG OUT OF ORDER.
HOW DARE YOU.
I have laid down the gauntlet.
If the people i have mentioned in this message cannot provide me with their online existence prior to 2014, then you need to shut up.
you may as well tell me that i have been unfaithful to my girlfriend. also something that i could never do.
as and for the record, here is my brothers facebook account. I never thought i could use it as defence, because he has changed his name to protect his online identity. judjing by RU's users, this is obviously an ok arrangement.
https://www.facebook.com/sean.kearns.904?fref=ts
please do not bombard him with this craziness. he will never forgive me.
you all have 24 hours. the clock is ticking....
you all have labelled me as a cheat, and I am doing nothing out of the ordinary to refute this. to try to label me due to bad language is childish.
I live in a city, where bad language is the first languaqge. to deny me this, is to deny my very existence.
When i accuse you guys of wrongdoing, i expect nothing but foul language. to pretend you don't use foul language, is to pretend you are a child.
the clock is ticking. 24 hours.
prove you exist. or be an abomination.

---------- Post added at 04:36 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:50 AM ----------

I cannot believe I am compelled to say these things.
I have read over these comments, and even though I agree with them, I cannot believe i have the need to say them.
I have tears in my eyes, and they are not because of laughter.
I am disgusted.
I am betrayed.
I am your victim.
I am a gamer. that is all.

[QAOP Spaceman]

Let's start by keeping this non-personal as per request.

So rather than beinga 'disgusted', 'betrayed', 'victim' etc. let's look at the cool impersonal facts.

Originally Posted by gastrainga

- Only on 5 games were replays provided of the top scores he submitted (19xx, Bubbles, Burning Rubber, Raiden, Sonic Wings).

So there would be changes on 14 of 19 games or 74% of the games. Pretty bad compliance with the rule requiring video evidence be kept for all scores.

-George

No accusations, no bullying, just FACTS. Anuone woujld need to do 'em again. ANYONE. Even CaptainJivePants.


Now, lets move on to the more personal part.

Because it does get personal when you name names, no?


(Incidentally, not 100% sure why I make it on to the list of six ne'er-do-wells, as there are literally dozens and dozens of others you could have picked.)



I'm fairly sure josephjo existed before 2014, as he was a high score champ on RU back in 2010.


And TodayisForgotten had a pre-2014 existence too, because there he is on the 2013 list.


Xelnia, to be honest... I have doubts about him/her too.


I'm sure the good Dr Sage can vouch for him/herself.


If CaptainJivePants didn't exist, we would need to invent him.



I'm having doubts about whether I exist, existed, or am damned just to exist as an abomination after this 24 deadline thingy. I don't have facebook, as under my space helmet I wear a trusty tinfoil hat.

I don't need to prove whether I exist because all my mediocre useless eatin' inps are in RU's hands, datestamped and coming direct from my IP address in a large continental European city. They definitely exist.



Tick, tick, tick.


Don't be disgusted or betrayed - play some games and record the inp next time.

Too much time on this. Back to Mr Do!

[kernzy]

hahahaaa!!! lol!
I agree.
however, i will need you to prove your existence via facebook, otherwise, according to the guidelines i have been given, you do not exist. Having an RU account does not count. you could be anyone. you could be an imposter. what is your real name? have you proof? etc...
I need real proof, otherwise, you are not real. you do not exist.
see what I'm facing
no offence intended. But to be offended, is to cause offence.
knowwaddamean?

---------- Post added at 05:51 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:49 AM ----------

i honestly looked through the last 2 pages of this thread, and singled out people who said something against me, who have no online prescence, apart from on RU.
according to my guidelines, that is DODGY!! lol!!

[QAOP Spaceman]

Originally Posted by kernzy

according to the guidelines i have been given

You've been given special guidelines?

[Dr_SaGe]

Originally Posted by kernzy

i will need you to prove your existence via facebook, otherwise, according to the guidelines i have been given, you do not exist.

No one here needs to prove their existence, because we all exist. We're all chatting in a forum. You called me a "tard" the other day, so I know you exist. You know who didn't call me a "tard?" Dave1 or Patrick. From the beginning of this, they are the only two people that needed to prove they exist. I know that if something was so important to me (as it clearly is to you based on the amount of time you've spent composing posts on here), my brother and cousin would be more than happy to take a few minutes of their time to clear the air for me.

And now I shall return to sticking my tongue down long holes, searching for ants...

[TodayIsForgotten]

@kernzy Why am i being called out? All i am doing is giving you avenues. I couldn't care less about this whole situation. I never once mentioned anything about your scores nor have i said you were guilty.

I don't know how much clearer i need to be.

Also. I am not giving you my Facebook. Sorry. It does have my real name, but i don't need people outside of this issue and most importantly you, looking at my fb, THAT, i only accept from people i know.

I have no problem making a video of me playing. What game would you like me to play?

If it really matters. You can find my name everywhere. Just type in Todayisforgotten or Todaysforgotten (incude xbox, xbox live, xbla).

[F_Symbols]

Allow me to appease you sir, at least in the case of Xelnia;



Picture from November 2013 at KO3, Xelnia is in this picture.

Updated PS3 scores (2012/3/26, 19:03 UTC) - Pac-Man Championship Edition DX Message Board for Xbox 360 - GameFAQs

^ Here is a link to a forum on gamefaq's from early 2012, where you can see Xelnia posting, these go all the way back into late 2011, I'm just too lazy to go find them for you.

He's a person, sorry to s#!& in your stocking...

I'd also like to add that requesting proof of existence is making this personal and in no way relevant to your accused actions. You broke the rules of the tournament (points 1 and 2 above); that is called cheating. Perhaps your definition of cheating is different than others in this event. When you "cheated" it warranted the questioning of your integrity. It never was personal, it had to do with a competitor not following the rules, AKA cheating. Had any other person, out of the 100+ players in this tournament done what you did, they would have met the same fate. It never was personal, it was about the act (of cheating) NOT the person. However, now you are trying to pull a bunch of other random people down, who have not been suspected of cheating in any way <- that's called making it personal; retaliation with a capital "T". Until the event coordinators find reason to question the integrity, or existence of, the other players, there is no reason why they should need to prove anything to you; what I am saying is you don't have any clout here, why do you think you can demand anything as proof when you are the accused?

I would recommend accepting your imminent fate in the IGBY, apologizing for your past wrongs (which some people see as a form of cheating, whether it aligns with your definition or not) and making a positive effort to move forward; Slinging mud and responding with rage-laden personal attacks is really not doing anything good for your credibility now or for future events.

-Fin

[QAOP Spaceman]

Originally Posted by F_Symbols

He's a person

Could be a hologram.

[Dudebro]

Not that his existence or integrity was ever really in question but I can vouch for Jojo. When I was a mod I saw his IP coming from the location he claims to live in no one else ever logged in from there.

[Thundarr]

Originally Posted by gastrainga

Note that removing any of kernzy's scores that don't have videos would mean:
...
... there would be changes on 14 of 19 games or 74% of the games. Pretty bad compliance with the rule requiring video evidence be kept for all scores.

-George

thanks, yeah I can see it makes sense to remove those 74% then. I'm not sure what "rule requiring" you're talking about though.

I don't see in the rules above, anything about such a requirement. from what I can see, it doesn't even say the scores will necessarily be DQ'd, although that would obviously make sense.

I'm looking at rule #4 above:

"4. Adjudication – we all know or know of each other generally speaking so there should be no need for this. Players are encouraged to save their INPs for all game play. Disputes (if any) will be handled on a case by case basis and reviewed by all sites."

I'm seeing the word "encouraged," not "required." so to me it looks like the rules support the possible DQ of scores without inp backup, but I don't see anything in there to support DQing the player who fails to provide inp's for scores. from what wolfman has said it seems he had this understanding as well. at HighScore.com, wolfman responded to my comment about video:

"if I play on an arcade cab I suppose I will need to make a video & it will need to show evidence that it is on default settings. For example the local Robotron machine is made easier unfortunately. set for bonus lives every 20k. "
Posted by S.BAZ on 2014-06-25 23:34:00 Reply



wolfman24

"well the video is not required it is only for disputes which i doubt that we are going to have"


...suggesting his understanding is I can play on an arcade cab & submit my score without video -- only cautioning me to be aware it might not count if there happens to be a dispute about it. definitely no warning about disqualification, and definitely saying it's "not required."

I apologize if I'm missing something but this point seems to have perhaps been overlooked. it has been suggested that failure to produce inp's is enough to kick someone out of the tournament.

summary of my viewpoint:
1. there is no proof that kernzy forged accounts
2. there is apparently no rule barring continued participation based on failure to produce inp's or any other form of evidence.

I don't see a reason to kick him out of the tournament.

[Barra]

As long as Paul blatantly ignores our requests to prove these people are who he says they are, the tournament organisers have to act under the assumption that these people do not exist and therefore foul play has occurred at his own hands. This is obviously against the rules and nature of any competition.
(A facebook link to someone with a different name is not going to help him prove that, if anything it probably hurts his cause)

I would not try and play the "innocent until proven guilty" card either, there has been AMPLE opportunity to prove everyone wrong. Wait long enough and that card is reversed unfortunately.

I think I covered these points pretty well:

Originally Posted by Thundarr

summary of my viewpoint:
1. there is no proof that kernzy forged accounts
2. there is apparently no rule barring continued participation based on failure to produce inp's or any other form of evidence.

[Thundarr]

Originally Posted by Barra

...I think I covered these points pretty well

well if the organizers of the tournament are the judges in this matter and they have professed a "guilty until proven innocent" policy then yes it is as you say.

I don't know if that is the procedure, or if we are to vote & that decides it. If it's a vote & that's how you feel Barra, I respect you & I'll respect your vote.

but personally, IMO that is a tyrannical policy regarding disputes which does not produce fair results. neither way is perfect but initially presuming guilt leads to much more abuse, IMO.

if it is the organizers to decide, I don't know why they should have to make such an unfounded presumption. there is suggestive evidence, nothing more. kernzy has said he did not fake their existence. you say he ignored the request to prove it, but actually he has responded saying they have ceased participating & that their mistakes & their existence are not his responsibility. if what he says is true (and it IS plausible) then that's right he has no responsibility for them.

I have to say I also do not understand this idea about reversing the "card."

from an "innocent until proven guilty" perspective he never had any obligation to prove anyone wrong in the 1st place. so regardless of how much ample time he has had, I don't see what would cause this "reversal" of it.