Can current technology detect ghosts?

[RU Joe]

First of all I would like to say that although I believe in the spiritual world in certain ways, I am very skeptical of most information available on the internet on the subject and even more so with TV.

However, while watching a few of these new ghost/ haunting TV shows {so we could poke fun at them} one show called Ghost Adventures, whose crew use VERY interesting equipment to conduct their investigations of hauntings caught my eye.

Most interesting of all to me was a setup using Kinect, where they had it scanning for unseen forms {I don't own a Kinect so I can't tell you what mode that may be}, and they managed to capture something invisible to the human eye.
BAHH! I said to myself, come on now - what you probably have there are shadows accumulating in the room making those shapes, right?
{and it's TV!}

So I searched for 'kinect ghost' on youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuCbpTD7YT0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kuCbpTD7YT0)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSHLmFRcup0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSHLmFRcup0)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1D25gtJdzuQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1D25gtJdzuQ)

Anyone who owns a Kinect ever see anything like that?
:search:

[Dudebro]

No, because ghosts aren't real. I've seen some of these shows and they just walk around in the dark saying "did you hear that!" and "did you feel that?!". It's a load of crap.

[KATZ]

we were playing dance central and something came up when everyone was getting a drink and it tried to buy "hit me baby one more time" you could see the form and everything

[QAOP Spaceman]

No, because ghosts aren't real. I've seen some of these shows and they just walk around in the dark saying "did you hear that!" and "did you feel that?!". It's a load of crap.

This is why Dudebro has so many posts here.

He gets to the nub of things so quickly, the rest of us don't have to.

:ghost:wooooooooooooooooooooooooo

And Joe, that dancing Berzerk humanoid in the first video you posted... arf :face:

[maxh]

we were playing dance central and something came up when everyone was getting a drink and it tried to buy "hit me baby one more time" you could see the form and everything

I was on the fence until I read Katz's post. Clarity.

[Dudebro]

This is why Dudebro has so many posts here.

He gets to the nub of things so quickly, the rest of us don't have to.

:ghost:wooooooooooooooooooooooooo

I apologize for being so direct :foot-in-mouth: Next time I'll sting JG along for a few more posts.

But seriously this is one of those issues that bugs me, specifically tv supernatural investigators. They get paid a bunch of money to pretend to experience things. It wouldn't be so bad but people tend to believe it or at least hope there's truth to it. It gives people false hope that their loved ones might be hanging around waiting to talk to them. It's almost as bad as psychics. I heard the term grief vampire when Sylvia Browne died and I think it fits. There needs to be a law.

[QAOP Spaceman]

But seriously this is one of those issues that bugs me, specifically tv supernatural investigators. They get paid a bunch of money to pretend to experience things. It wouldn't be so bad but people tend to believe it or at least hope there's truth to it. It gives people false hope that their loved ones might be hanging around waiting to talk to them. It's almost as bad as psychics.

Nailed it again, man.

The cold-reading psychic fraud scumbags are far worse, because their victims are the vulnerable, the lonely, the bereaved, the unstable. And they make a fortune from them.

:at-wits-end:

At least the TV spook-mongers are really only ripping off the credulous. And the slow-witted.

[samejamesbond]

He gets to the nub of things so quickly, the rest of us don't have to.

http://www.retrouprising.com/img/2015_01/5129.jpg

It's pretty much the reason I post so little, Kong and DB beat you to the
punch and there's no reason to contribute.

[Dudebro]

Yeah the ghost hunters aren't so bad because only really gullible people believe reality tv is real. Those kind of people will fall for anything anyways. Btw I don't mean JG he's no dummy.

As for people who claim to be psychics? I'd love to punch them in the face and then ask them why they didn't see it coming. That reminds me of one who works in my town. Her store front was smashed in by a car and my first thought was why didn't she see it coming? Pretty damn irresponsible of her, that driver could've been killed! Another one I just remembered, some "amateur" psychic predicted that a loved one of mine will die young and their kid will be without a parent. This was after we all found out about a terminal illness. That's probably the closest I've come to plotting an assault or a murder. Where I come from that's the kind of thing that causes ghetto people to wait outside your house and jump you. Looking back I should've at least slashed their tires or something.


@SJB- You guys are making me :redface: it's hard to see because my face is so hairy but trust me I'm blushing.

[QAOP Spaceman]

Btw I don't mean JG he's no dummy.

As for people who claim to be psychics? I'd love to punch them in the face and then ask them why they didn't see it coming.

Agreed and agreed :)

[maxh]

Agreed and agreed :)

So it is safe to say that Katz's post failed to sway others...

Selling these claims for commercial gain certainly seems less than appropriate.

What about stories (and I have none specifically to refer to) about psychics that have alleged to have successfully assisted in crime investigations where the success was not noted by the psychic, but by the crime investigators?

[QAOP Spaceman]

(and I have none specifically to refer to)

Neither does anyone else, I suspect.

And given that virtual everyone in the developed world walks around with video cameras in their pockets, isn't it astonishing that there has never been one convincing documented sighting of our clain-clanking, woooo-ing chums?

:ghost: - - - :ghost: - - - :ghost: - - - :ghost: - - - :ghost:

[maxh]

Neither does anyone else, I suspect.

And given that virtual everyone in the developed world walks around with video cameras in their pockets, isn't it astonishing that there has never been one convincing documented sighting of our clain-clanking, woooo-ing chums?

:ghost: - - - :ghost: - - - :ghost: - - - :ghost: - - - :ghost:

I was off topic already and moving towards psychic claims, rather than the OP question. But since I'm off topic, a mildly interesting link relating follows for those that might be interested.

Psychic detective - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[QAOP Spaceman]

'Joe Power' is typical of this nonsense.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtlhjsiBEDw&list=PL91BA69E61C5ECE6F

[maxh]

'Joe Power' is typical of this nonsense.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtlhjsiBEDw&list=PL91BA69E61C5ECE6F

I'm not selling or defending, rather, I'm fairly amused by the topic in general (and I'm in a NyQuil, sleep deprived stupor).

As for the link above, I could not agree more that that sort of thing is pure nonsense.

[QAOP Spaceman]

I'm not selling or defending, rather, I'm fairly amused by the topic in general

Truth told, I'm not 100% closed to the idea of ghosts, or sprites as they used to be called :)

And to get back to Joe's original post - or the title at least - it's worth bearing mind that just because something can't be measured yet certainly doesn't mean it ain't there.

Like most of us, I suppose, the inner 10-yr-old sincerely does want to believe.

But until something can be verifiable shown to have happened - as opposed to said to have happened or alleged to have happened, or thought to have happened - well....

:bomb:

[bearhawk72]

Yeah the ghost hunters aren't so bad because only really gullible people believe reality tv is real. Those kind of people will fall for anything anyways. Btw I don't mean JG he's no dummy.

As for people who claim to be psychics? I'd love to punch them in the face and then ask them why they didn't see it coming. That reminds me of one who works in my town. Her store front was smashed in by a car and my first thought was why didn't she see it coming? Pretty damn irresponsible of her, that driver could've been killed! Another one I just remembered, some "amateur" psychic predicted that a loved one of mine will die young and their kid will be without a parent. This was after we all found out about a terminal illness. That's probably the closest I've come to plotting an assault or a murder. Where I come from that's the kind of thing that causes ghetto people to wait outside your house and jump you. Looking back I should've at least slashed their tires or something.


@SJB- You guys are making me :redface: it's hard to see because my face is so hairy but trust me I'm blushing.
Ah yes, so you can talk to ghosts and they can tell you everything(vaguely) but they just can't come out and tell you their name and how they know the person you are talking to? Is that against ghost rules or something?

Not to derail the topic, but what if "ghosts" are just you or other people in a parallel universe "bleeding" into our universe? This might be the case if the multiverse idea is true.

[Dudebro]

@Maxh- I think if you took all the psychic detectives cases and compared them you'd see that they're wrong more often than not. Anyone who reads about crimes a lot would be able to guess right some of the time. A broken clock is right twice a day, right?

@Spacebro- It's certainly possible that ghosts could be detected at some point in the future. We know almost nothing about what happens to us when we die so there's a chance that our consciousness lives on in some way. It'd be pretty lame if we just floated around our loved ones though.

@BH- Yeah that bugs me too, if they can talk to us then why are they so vague about it? It's as if no smart people turn into ghosts it's just simpletons who forgot how to communicate when they crossed over.

Seeing through the veil of another dimension would be a much cooler explanation.

[George Riley]

OK, I have actually caught a UKS Unidentified Knocking Sound on a camera. This was when me, and my nephew were going through an abandoned Air Force hospital. This was inside the morgue. As I was opening the door I heard a knocking sound that was very close to my face. My nephew was several feet back when this happened. As I said, it did creep me out, and I wanted out of that hospital as fast as possible. https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Fu68XJ5MCWk#t=495

[Slime Slayer]

OK, I have actually caught a UKS Unidentified Knocking Sound on a camera. This was when me, and my nephew were going through an abandoned Air Force hospital. This was inside the morgue. As I was opening the door I heard a knocking sound that was very close to my face. My nephew was several feet back when this happened. As I said, it did creep me out, and I wanted out of that hospital as fast as possible. https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Fu68XJ5MCWk#t=495

I had a weird experience at an abandon hospital too. Me and my buddy went in and we could here this really creepy guitar, it was playing really weird stuff, We knocked on the wall a few times to scare it off, but it wouldn't stop, we got outta there in a hurry, needless to say... To this day we often bring up the musical ghost.

[RU Joe]

No, because ghosts aren't real. I've seen some of these shows and they just walk around in the dark saying "did you hear that!" and "did you feel that?!". It's a load of crap.
I found this video which debunks a lot of ghost - related TV shows, in my opinion:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghOO0iKQ_f0 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghOO0iKQ_f0)

They didn't mention the 'spirit box', the Ovilus device, or the Kinect figures though.

Katz:
we were playing dance central and something came up when everyone was getting a drink and it tried to buy "hit me baby one more time" you could see the form and everything It must have been creepy to watch.
What do you think happened that time?

QAOP:

And Joe, that dancing Berzerk humanoid in the first video you posted... arf :face:
That part of this phenomenon I find difficult to understand: the rapid movements made by these 'figures'.
My gut is saying technical/ software glitch/ misalignment causing this but then what about Katz' story?

And to get back to Joe's original post - or the title at least - it's worth bearing mind that just because something can't be measured yet certainly doesn't mean it ain't there.

Good point, and I think most of these shows fall way short in their detection methods; not nearly enough sensor equipment and their methods in general seem sloppy and unscientific.
{and it's just TV}
In a way I kind of don't want ghosts to be real because the idea gives me the creeps .. but I don't know exactly why that is because if they are real, then technically we are all potential ghosts - to - be.:-\

BH:
Not to derail the topic, but what if "ghosts" are just you or other people in a parallel universe "bleeding" into our universe? This might be the case if the multiverse idea is true. I like the theory of multiverses because then at least we'd know ghosts aren't just all in our heads.
:curl-lip:
GR:
OK, I have actually caught a UKS Unidentified Knocking Sound on a camera. This was when me, and my nephew were going through an abandoned Air Force hospital. This was inside the morgue. As I was opening the door I heard a knocking sound that was very close to my face. My nephew was several feet back when this happened. As I said, it did creep me out, and I wanted out of that hospital as fast as possible.Be careful when you go in those places - and I'm not saying anyone should - there could be anything in there hanging out, and old buildings are dangerous too.
I don't mean to doubt your experience George but is it possible the sound was being reflected from another source?
Also, just being in a place like that would probably freak most people out and give them the 'heebie - jeebies'; when I'm in that state I'm ready to leap out of my own skin at the smallest sound! :tremble:
SC13:
I had a weird experience at an abandon hospital too. Me and my buddy went in and we could here this really creepy guitar, it was playing really weird stuff, We knocked on the wall a few times to scare it off, but it wouldn't stop, we got outta there in a hurry, needless to say... To this day we often bring up the musical ghost.
There is a technological possibility: surface vibration speakers.
{oh the fun you could have using those}

Sorry to take so long to respond but in a way I'm glad I did, since you guys covered a lot of ground here already.
Putting the Kinect phenomenon on the back burner for a second, I want to address the auditory sensing methods used typically by 'ghost hunters', starting with EVP's

Is it just me, or do EVP's seem a bit unbelievable?
I don't think I've heard one yet that can be heard clearly enough to say:
'Ok, that is certainly a ghost's voice caught on this tape'
and although many TV shows make it seem like they are receiving direct responses - it is still just TV, entertainment first and foremost, which makes it seem unlikely to me that this is real at all.

'Spirit Box' devices, continuously scanning through a pre - programmed spectrum of radio frequencies, listening for EVP's in real time.
One device is capable scanning 4 different frequencies per second in one mode, which, as the GA show claims, makes it easy to rule out radio interference.
The theory sounds pretty solid to me.
They contain a database of words to choose from, but what I find very interesting is how this device can somehow inflect age and gender in the voice when it's heard!
{remembering it is TV}

The other audio device they use, 'Ovilus' is also listening for EVP's in real time,
and while I'm not certain how this one scans for voices it has an interesting feature:
Phonetic Mode Speech is formed by using phonemes, the basic blocks of human speech. I find that really fascinating.

---------- Post added 01-15-2015 at 03:44 AM ---------- Previous post was 01-13-2015 at 12:52 AM ----------

Thread dead?

http://www.retrouprising.com/img/2015_01/5155.jpg

In case this will be the last post of the thread, I just want to add a few more things regarding ghost - detecting equipment:

I am currently unable to debunk the 'spirit box' 'SB7', nor the 'Ovilus' device and the reason is how those devices work.
These devices scan 4 different radio frequencies per second {in one mode}, meaning if any voices are heard through them, it is highly unlikely interference as even single - syllable words generally take at least 1 full second to say.
Newer models make it possible to scan 2 channels simultaneously, one sweeping up the scale while the other sweeps down .. further decreasing interference - related sounds being heard through the speakers ..

I know most of you are tech - savvy and therefore understand what I meant by this, but in layman's terms it basically means that:

Under normal conditions, these devices should not have voices of any kind being heard through their speakers, because they switch through radio frequencies so rapidly as to make it impossible to have a single word assimilate {in my opinion} through regular radio interference.
So, why do they?
???

IF ANY of it is true, and on the extremely rare chance that there are such things as spirits or ghosts:

I would like to see a serious scientific investigation, starting with a thorough search of the intended subject location using devices like heat sensitive cameras as well as dogs to rule out the presence of any animals, homeless people or anything else which could cause noises inside the location.

Once the perimeter has been secured and is being patrolled, an overlapping/ redundant, tight sensor grid system is put in place measuring radioactivity, organic vapors, air quality/ oxygen content, barometric pressure, low - frequency vibration, EMF - everything would be taken into consideration including moon phase.
The main reason for the extra measures would be to rule out anyone entering the house who experiences phenomenon physically being affected by any of those things, and participants would wear special suits monitoring all their body functions, temperature in each part of the suit, and even brain activity.

The entire site would be observed from within on microphones capable of capturing sounds less than 1 Bel.
{this being the quietest sound audible by the human ear}
Overlapping cameras of every conceivable type including an enhanced Kinect 3D mapping system would cover all the interior areas and the entire site would be observed by flying drones from outside as well.
Small robots equipped with the same array of cameras would patrol the interior of areas including areas too small for humans to enter, some ground - based, some flying.
Rotating human, robotic, and combination patrols would continue throughout the investigation.

Since conventional theory is that spirits use the electricity from DC sources to manifest themselves, banks of car batteries would be placed at regular intervals inside the location with the hope that spirits would be able to use their energy instead of drawing from the batteries or power supplies in various detection equipment or the robots.
The banks' voltage/ current levels would be monitored with fresh replacement banks being recharged continuously off site.

This entire system remains in place for at least one full month pending results, recording the most minute detail of every event should any occur.
That's about all I can think of right now.

[Ballas]

No, but I keep watching the damn shows thinking maybe they find something... :-)

[RU Joe]

No, but I keep watching the damn shows thinking maybe they find something... :-)
I know, right!
They sort of have us where GA is the most scientific of the lot {not saying much there}, and even they resort to having mediums, witches, warlocks, etc. on their show - which destroys the credibility for me.
One of those shows goes the other direction, where they try to 'provoke' the spirits by covering themselves in pig blood and stuff - great show if you're into that sort of thing I guess, but there really needs to be serious work done on this sometime.

BTW please forgive me for having typed 'the entire' 3 times in my last post.
I typed 'the entire site' twice!!
:face:
Could it have been spiritual interference?

[RU Joe]

It seems appropriate to make this post here:

TV Ghost Hunters found dead in apartment (https://ca.news.yahoo.com/tv-ghost-hunters-found-dead-apartment-085019358.html)

Sad news - Mark and Debbie Constantino are dead; to those interested in paranormal research, they were considered experts on E.V.P. {electronic voice phenomenon} - a process by which audio recordings made in allegedly haunted locations sometimes contain possible voices of the dead.

From what I have read on several sites:

They had a turbulent relationship often degrading into violent exchanges.

She had attacked him at one point, slashing his arm with a knife.
After that they appear to have started living apart, because of how the rest of the story goes..

Debbie had a restraining order on him which he broke.
He kidnapped her, and killed one of her roommates some time during the process of doing so.
He took her to another location, fired shots at Police through the door and, after flash-bang grenades were used to gain entry, both Mark and Debbie were found dead inside.

In true paranormal enthusiast fashion, someone has already requested permission to investigate the site of the Constantinos' death, to see if there are any signs of their presence.