Online multiplayer, good or bad?

[Slime Slayer]

So I'm sitting back and thinking about this, and I'm worrying about the fact that it's becomming more and more of a staple of gaming. I've been playing SSF43de online, and I am finding myself getting enraged at the game and not enjoying it.
I think the problem lies in the fact that, to compete with the better online guys takes such an intense concentration, that it's kinda loosing it's fun. You can't just sit back and relax while you play. You used to be able to earn the relaxing part by playing a game till you got comfortable with it, then you just cruise along with style.
Facing the facts, the vast majority of us are never going to be so good at any online game that we can conquer the challenge of the top teir players, it's just going to be a never ending uphill battle that we eventually give up on. Any thoughts?

[Dudebro]

I think the problem is you're not playing the game constantly like the people who are really good at it. Every fighting game I've played has that problem. You have some people who are just casual and trying to have fun and then you have the die hards who play all the time and have the moves down to a science. The kind of people who know each move down to it's frame rate or w/e it's called.
This problem ruined Tekken6 for me. Even if you avoid ranked matches to get away from them they jump into normal matches to pwn noobs and get a reaction. The genre breeds this elitist attitude, much like with FPS.

But that being said the minority of jerks doesn't make all online bad. If you play the right games you can have great experiences.

[Seahawk]

I think the problem is the fact that it is a fighting game. The only thing you can do is fight other players, which is limited to a friend nearby, the computer, or people online.

Also, it sounds like you are not playing hard enough. Fighting games are very competitive. It's not a genre you can relax in and expect to win against other players.

[Dudebro]

The only thing you can do is fight other players, which is limited to a friend nearby, the computer, or people online.This is true and also fighting against the computer gets old fast so you're forced to seek out multiplayer. I think the only way to really enjoy a casual fighting game is with friends. Unless your friends are also diehards.

It's not a genre you can relax in and expect to win against other players.This is also true, sadly. I love fighting games but I'm just not competitive enough to compete with anyone besides my friends. Even my friends are better than me but only a little, they don't take it very seriously either.

[Slime Slayer]

I guess to clarify my point, it's not so much about any specific genre or game, it's more so that the difficulty of whatever game is at hand is no longer being decided by the director, it's now falling into the hands of the masses. I'm worried that this could ruin my enjoyment for all things online multiplayer. I don't have the time, or the drive (and probably not the ability either) to keep up with the kids these days. I'm gonna be left behind in the future if I can't learn to adapt.

[Dudebro]

Sorry I don't get it. Multiplayer online is not that different than offline. You're just making it semi anonymous and adding a million people to the rotation. The difficulty of a game has always been decided by how well the masses play the game, if we're talking about multiplayer.

You are getting old, we all are. If you don't have the free time to stay up all night playing a fighting game then you just won't be able to pwn. It sucks but at least you can laugh at the try hards for trying so hard.

[Kugyince]

I hate online multiplayer. Always have. It's just too indirect.

That being saidm I would enjoy a Friend's List only type of online multiplayer.

[Dudebro]

That feature is pretty old too Tenser, it's called private matches. Pretty sure that's been around since the invention of online gaming. What you hate is public games.

[Kugyince]

I already know how old that feature is.

I'm stating that I could enjoy that type of online gaming.

[joz]

I wish I had a system to play online to begin with. Steven complaining about it just made me think he's ungrateful. Die hard fans are everywhere not just online. I remember when I would go to the local arcade place to play MVC2, there was always a hand full of guys who were experts with their favorite team. If I saw them playing, I'd play once then wait for them to finish so I can play with the guys more around my level. So if there is a way to play people of your skill level, play there. If the top tier guys suddenly jump in there to pwn you, tough. Suck it up and play the next round with someone else. That or join a private group.

[Seahawk]

I guess to clarify my point, it's not so much about any specific genre or game, it's more so that the difficulty of whatever game is at hand is no longer being decided by the director, it's now falling into the hands of the masses.

The masses have always had control over how hard games are. Make a game too hard, and it simply won't sell well. Super Mario Bros. 2 was converted for the USA specifically because Nintendo thought it was too hard. Square toned down Final Fantasy 4 on the SNES in the USA because they thought it was too hard. This isn't a new thing.

Developers have more control over difficulty now more than ever. It's called patching. Blizzard has tweaked the original Starcraft via patching since 1998. PS3 and 360 games are updated a lot. Nintendo is anti-online so they never do this.

I'm worried that this could ruin my enjoyment for all things online multiplayer. I don't have the time, or the drive (and probably not the ability either) to keep up with the kids these days. I'm gonna be left behind in the future if I can't learn to adapt.

When I started playing Starcraft online I quickly gave up on playing ranked matches. I have much more fun playing custom maps. If there isn't any custom matches feature in Street Fighter for your 3DS then you'll simply have to give up on the online segment.

[jim5cents]

When I first started working at this place, there was a student who sat in the top 3 in the world rankings of Halo 2 for about 4 or 5 months, changing off between a couple of other players for the top spot. He played about 6-8 hours a day. He got offers to be sponsered in professional tournament and ultimately, he turned it all down. He basically got burned out, it wasn't fun to be playing at that level, to always be competing instead of having fun with it. He would consistantly have games of 10:1 KDR, but he simply wasn't having fun with it. He did enjoy the difficulty of playing against live players as opposed to A.I., but it was the constant, cutthroat nature of online gaming, the always being a new competator that wanted a piece of you because of his ranking.

From my personal experience, private matches are by far the most fun. Next are public matches where you have a party on the same team. Least fun is when you play by yourself.

[joz]

Least fun is when you play by yourself.

Warghoul would disagree with this comment.

[Slime Slayer]

The masses have always had control over how hard games are. Make a game too hard, and it simply won't sell well. Super Mario Bros. 2 was converted for the USA specifically because Nintendo thought it was too hard. Square toned down Final Fantasy 4 on the SNES in the USA because they thought it was too hard. This isn't a new thing.
You just cited 2 examples where the developers have decided on the games difficulty. besides that, a games difficulty being any sort of major impact how well it sells is false.
Can you give some examples of games that didnt sell because they were too hard?

@Jozz, ungrateful? I'm sorry, I didnt realise this was something I was supposed to put in the same category as freinds, family, and health. Seriously though, were talking about playing online gaming.

[joz]

Okay, perhaps it was a bit extreme. But still man. You're complaining about something that you don't even need to use. Online gaming is a bonus as far as I'm concerned.

[Slime Slayer]

Okay, perhaps it was a bit extreme. But still man. You're complaining about something that you don't even need to use. Online gaming is a bonus as far as I'm concerned.

Honestly I'm not as concerned about it as much as it sounds, I just thought it would be a good conversation piece. I know that single player will always be where it's at for me. For the forseable future anyway.

[jim5cents]

Originally Posted by jim5cents http://retrouprising.com/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://retrouprising.com/video-games/all-other-games/online-multiplayer-good-bad/t11515/#post177916)
Least fun is when you play by yourself.
Warghoul would disagree with this comment.

I know that single player will always be where it's at for me. For the forseable future anyway.

The hits just keep on coming.

[elrod21]

I personally shy away from multiplayer for the most part. I just got sick of how serious people got while playing those games. These were first person shooters mostly so maybe playing on something like SF4 would be different.

[Dudebro]

I personally shy away from multiplayer for the most part. I just got sick of how serious people got while playing those games. These were first person shooters mostly so maybe playing on something like SF4 would be different.
Sorry but I think you have this backwards. FPS communities have their share of die hards but there's also plenty of newbs and middle of the road people. Fighting games are chock full of elitist try hards. I tried playing SF4, Tekken6, Soul Caliber 4, DOA and even brawl but it seems like I'm not good enough for anything but private/custom matches. I think the 1v1 nature of fighting games makes it a lot more frustrating and it drives away normal players. At least in a FPS it's usually a big room full of people with varying levels of skill.


Btw while we're on the topic of fighting games I'd like to say that I think the emphasis on combos and juggling has pretty much ruined the genre for me. I could take the time to learn the timing and moves but I hate long combos that take off tons of health. Games like Tekken6 have juggles that can pretty much kill you in one string of moves. I find that to be a joke but apparently the community loves it.

[joz]

I hate air juggles and infinite combos...sometimes I when I would be playing at the arcade, some douche would come and do an infinite combo in the first round, on the second round I would just sit back and not do anything at all. Then I would wait for the douche to finish the game and I'd continue playing after he's done. If he puts in another quarter to play me again, I would just straight up tell him he sucks for using infinite combos and I would walk away to play something else.

[Dudebro]

But you realize he most likely thinks he won that exchange right? These kind of people rationalize being a douche by saying it's your fault for sucking and getting mad about it.

I miss the good old days of fighting games where a 10 hit combo was hard to do and people only used it too show off, and it was actually blockable. Now you have to be rainman to stand a chance against some 20+ hit combo that is all over the place.

[bearhawk72]

I play very few games online anymore because it seems near impossible to find good games

Uncharted 2 is beyond horrible. If people aren't exploiting glitches, they're teaming up(you are allowed to party up then take on a team full of randoms) in Objective maps and either pinning you in your spawn, or hiding the treasure, not capturing it, and running around killing everyone. To make it worse if you leave a game while it's active you get penalized. The coop modes people won't even work together and are just out for themselves.

The only decent games I've played online are Ghostbusters and Burnout Paradise, but even then you have to keep booting people who aren't trying to accomplish anything but annoy you.

[joz]

I don't really care if he thought he won the exchange nor was I really mad about it. I really hated that part about MVC2 and that's why I love SF 3rd Strike. Check out this fight from start to finish. It's freaking Epic!

YouTube - Street Fighter - Justin vs Daigo

[Kugyince]

You realize Lost Levels wasn't brought to NA because of it's difficulty? It was turned down by NoA for being too similar to the original.

Got to love e-myths.

[Seahawk]

You just cited 2 examples where the developers have decided on the games difficulty. besides that, a games difficulty being any sort of major impact how well it sells is false.

The developers made that decision based on their perception on the skill level of the masses as you can them. That (to me at least) is gamer's control over the difficulty. I understand how you see it the other way though.

Can you give some examples of games that didnt sell because they were too hard?

Shooting games (the pinnacle of difficulty) never sell well in the US, to the point where publishers don't even bother bringing them here. Aksys recently decided that they are not going to bring any more to the US (Link (http://www.aksysgames.com/forums/topic/1111)).

You realize Lost Levels wasn't brought to NA because of it's difficulty? It was turned down by NoA for being too similar to the original.

Ok fine, either way if it had been brought over as is I believe it would have been a flop.
Also, I'm not saying I don't believe you, but I'd like to hear about that situation, can I get a source please? Thanks in advance.

[Kugyince]

Scrolling shooters is more of a cultural thing. The East loves them.

Visual Novels, Dating Sims, and standard Adventure games are also quite a lot more popular over there then here.

@SH:
Chrontendo Volume 20 : Dr. Sparkle : Free Download & Streaming : Internet Archive (http://www.archive.org/details/Chrontendo_Vol_20?start=0.5)

[Dudebro]

Shooting games (the pinnacle of difficulty) never sell well in the US, to the point where publishers don't even bother bringing them here.
I think the same thing applies to puzzle games. If you ask most gamers to name a good puzzle game I bet most will only come up with Tetris. US gamers just aren't that interested in extremely challenging games. Obviously there's always exceptions but that's how I see it.

[alohaex]

Online multiplayer is alright for me but when the higher classed player start thinking there better then you and start to sound off about your not doing it the way they would do it or that you not as good as then and don't deserve to play it is then when we have a problem. I play Dynasty Warriors online and it has players from all over the world although I stopped playing cause I screwed up remaking my character.

[Thunderlips]

I enjoy living a very balanced life and as much as I love video games my adult self has no time to refine into an online juggernaut so I am just fine with letting this guy be the big dawg in that world.

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRWrbT1DGHxPfjPNABRcQepvujrw4AaA O35_SUArN9QtxpGDHaayg


What I love about R.U. is I can get my fix and if I cant play for a month there is nobody kicking me out of a guild because I was the #1 tank and they couldnt raid the new dungeon to get that new armour that has + .00001 more hit rating then what they are currently wearing.
http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSfIFmZvDN0nPUE8OQK6H3sSlWIp1lnj gFtwr9MNth

[Demon-Mask]

I dislike online gaming for the most part, but I like the concept of it. If that makes sense at all. I enjoy playing multi-player, but I have very few friends and only one controller. I also like different games than many of my friends, and my favorite games are generally single-player, story driven RPGs. I like the concept of being able to play with someone of equal skill level halfway across the globe, but I don't like most of these people. Those annoying punks who find a spawn point and snipe you right when you respawn, the people who intentionally pass themselves off as average skill level and join low-level games just to troll. And let's not forget the thirty hit combo fighting game players who do nothing but play that one game all day, every day and have figured out every move to the frame. I just don't like the people. Not to mention, online games can get pretty laggy.

Online multi-player, good concept, generally terrible execution due to the frustrating, often cheap, players.

[SecretAgentCat]

I play alot of online multiplayer games. I think online multiplayer is blast when its a game that has its story line developed around a co-op intent. Co-op is a blast! I play some H2H games like COD and Battlefied but get more enjoyment out of a "help your friend" co-op adventure.

[bearhawk72]

I'm probably in the minority on this one, but I'm going to say it anyways

I think the use of mic's for online gaming is one of the worst things that has happened. Full of people just talking trash, no real communication, or people talking about random crap not related to the game. Yeah I know I can mute them but it's annoying as crap.

I've even been booted out of room because I don't have a mic. I tried to play GT5 with some people from another forum and they all kept complaining I don't have a mic and telling me to go buy one. If I had one(I kind of do with the PSeye) I wouldn't even use it.

I understand they can be useful but in my experience the people who use them almost never use them for anything constructive in the games.

[Dudebro]

I understand they can be useful but in my experience the people who use them almost never use them for anything constructive in the games.
You need to play different games. GT5 is Gran Turismo right? From my experience sports/racing/fighting games bring out the worst in some people. They get all extra competitive and if they can't trash talk you they get really mad. I tried to play Fight Night online and the amount of ridiculous morons I encountered was staggering.

[bearhawk72]

You need to play different games. GT5 is Gran Turismo right? From my experience sports/racing/fighting games bring out the worst in some people. They get all extra competitive and if they can't trash talk you they get really mad. I tried to play Fight Night online and the amount of ridiculous morons I encountered was staggering.
Yeah it's Gran Turismo, but pretty much every game, with the exception of Burnout Paradise, that I have that allows voice chat end up the same way.

[Dudebro]

Yeah but what kind of games are you talking about? Like I said above some game types attract the really bad gamers.

[bearhawk72]

Yeah but what kind of games are you talking about? Like I said above some game types attract the really bad gamers.
It's the same in Uncharted 2, any sports game, Ghostbusters,Blazing Angels 2

I mainly play offline anyways though so it's not a huge issue, just one of my annoyances.

[Dudebro]

I do understand the annoyance, I encounter it a lot myself. I just don't want you or anyone else to think it's the norm. Any social outlet has it's share of trolls and morons.

[Slime Slayer]

My old roomate used to use it for it's inteded purposes all the time, mind you I only ever heard him talking and never the other players.